Follies of the Minimum Wage

[Hugh]

Minimum wage brought in by the labour party but opposed by many conservatives many will now see the minimum wage wasn't such a good idea. I left the forces in 1983 long before the minimum wage came into being. The job I took was a very low wage and I had to work 60 to 70 hours a week to make ends meet But it was a job until I was able to progress to a better income. By the time the minimum wage came in I was above the minimum wage start point.
The point I am trying to make if the minimum wage structure was in place before 1983 the job would not have been there to get me started on the employment ladder. Employer are now finding it cheaper to use machines where possible in stead of expensive labour costs. Others are just sending there work abroad which is cheaper, even with transport cost. Some experts believe the unemployment will rise to 5 million by the end of this year. SO I ASK WAS THE MINIMUM WAGE STRUCTURE SUCH A GOOD IDEA?

[John]

The Minimum Wage was a European Directive along with Holidays.

There were no holidays except by contract conditions  before then.

Labour opted out of having Public Holidays (of which we have the lowest amount
in Europe) on top of the holidays. But rather part of them. Thus reducing holidays.

Of course it is up to the Country to actually set the amount of Minimum Pay.

Make it too high and as you say it reduces British Jobs.

Labour will bang on about this but what they have actually done is set it too high.

Nothing stops anybody paying above it. Nothing stops anyone refusing a job.

[Hugh]

The job market is now at an all time low and getting worse. For every vacancy there are hundreds applicants. The GYM I use advertised for a cleaner and they got inundated with applicants. The jobs that do remain employers limit over time rates and many only employ self employed personnel to avoid holiday pay. Every week you hear of firms closing and taking their work abroad. This Labour party you would have thought, would have given this matter some urgent thought. Minimum wage should have been set at a lower level or at a level depending on the profit of the item being produced.
Ivanhoe as been calling on young people to support us pensioners I believe they have enough problems of their own. It makes you sick to think young people over the boarder in Scotland pay no college fees this side they plan on increasing fees. This is just not right.

[Ivanhoe]

Britain has been a market lead economy culture since Thatcher introduced the low waged, low income tax, free market in  the 80s which remains in this country today.

I want young people supporting pensioners, many of whom will be their parents and grandparents, because what's happening to pensioners today, will also happen to young people in the future if things carry on as they are, in our continuing low waged, short term, insecure, work base.

You asking for a lower mnimum wage just about takes the biscuit, or should young people have to be grateful to work in your view ?

[Hugh]

Me being not the best with words, it as not come across the way I wanted it to.

This is what happened to my son during the years of Brown and he's not on his own by far. He was made redundant, and had to sell his home to pay off his mortgage and had a little left over. Because of this he is unable to claim unemployment benefits. He as now returned home to us. We are in a  position where we can support him but he his not happy about this, and would take any job even below the minimum wage which of course is now against the law. It is sickening to know goods which were once made in UK are now being imported all because of this minimum wage. Every job that now comes onto the market there are hundreds of applicants. So there are now many living in poverty or eating away at any savings they may have. When they could have been earning some thing under the now minimum wage. The minimum wage was a great Idea but at the moment it just not working for the many now unemployed.

Just because I did well under Thatcher it doesn't mean I voted for her and the conservative party. So far I have never voted conservative but I am a floater and not made up my mind who to vote for.   

[Ivanhoe]

Everything happening to you're son was initiated under Margaret Thatcher beginning in the 80's, New Labour have merely contrinued what she started.

The aim of the Thatcher ideoligy was to create unemployment on mass by way of free market deregulation, and inward competition to drive down wages and create more unemployment, so while you you'rself were doing well under Thatcher, both she and her ministers were creating over three million unemployed.

And just because your son would be happy to work for less than the minimum wage, it does'nt mean the entire country should have to.

In the 21st century, nobody should have to be "grateful" for work.

[Hugh]

I think the people who are unemployed should give there views not us. I know for one who would gladly work for £3 hour if it was going to save my home. I think you should ask the hundreds of folk around Britain losing their jobs and home at this moment. I feel for them. When I left the forces I work way below the now minimum wage but only for a few years, and with out the help of the minimum wage law bettered myself. I am very pleased the minimum wage law wasn't in at that time because my stepping stone into life out side the forces as long since gone.   

[Ivanhoe]

It comes across as you are trying to justify no Tory wages laws.

We must have the principle of a minimum wage in the modern 21sty century, or we go right back to victorian values which Thatcher brought in with no mimimum wage legislation.

Incidently in general I believe that anybody in life can "better" themselves if they have the "will", this goes without saying.

But I believe in a mimimum wage law for the public general, because nobody should be forced to work for poverty pay.

[John]

Minimum Wage are just two words in many areas.

There are enough sweat shops and practices in the UK
that run rings round this European Directive.

You need to able to afford to loose your job before you can complain and
then maybe someone looks into a below minimum wage situation.

Working legally and speaking English also helps...

[Hugh]

Sorry Ivanhoe if I am trying to justify the wage law. All I am trying to do is putting forward a very serious problem. Unemployment is growing at an alarming rate it is very depressing to hear every day of more job losses. I am not going into the blame game that does no good we are soon going to vote so its time to decide who will solve this problem.

[Ivanhoe]

The minimum wage is not a European Directive. 

A minimum wage has always been Labour party policy.

[Hugh]

I think you will find both your statements are true. It was a labour policy but pushed along by the EU and brought into being. It was being debated by the EU in 1985

[Ivanhoe]

/////I think you will find both your statements are true////

Yes they are, otherwise I wouldnt have said them.

[John]

'The minimum wage is not a European Directive'
 
It was brought about by a European Directive.

Labour could have implemented it 2 years earlier then it did,
if it was such a red hot proposition and not something that
its Trade Union roots sought.

Spurred on by parts of Europe that already had one.

[Ivanhoe]

A minimum wage is at the root of "traditional" Labour's manifesto.

"NEW" Labour are not traditional Labour, New Labour are fundamentally right wing, so you could be right.