Pension,s

[John Sheffield]

Chris,

I can see why your generation want to simply forget the past. Your generations treatment of other generations young and old is dispicable and history will remember it so.

You didn't need hindsight to know the implications Chris of breaking the pension-index in 1980. The result  was to begin a gradual reduction in the value of the state pension for pensioners over the last 30 years. Hardly a reward for the generation that fought the second world war.

This was done (as you probably well know) to enable Thatcher to reduce the deficit without raising income taxes and risking losing the votes of the baby boomers- then in your 30s. Now in 2010 faced with a bigger deficit, the Goverment is making young working families pay the price. Again sparing your generation. Not content with this the Tories are planning a massive hike in the state pension for new middle class pensioners timed to come in just around next election.

Did you read the 'sting in the tail', as I understand it the proposed increases will only apply to NEW pensioners. The final  intergenerational insult. You demand an increase in the state pension but only for new pensioners of your generation. By the way as you reach 65 in 2013 you'll just miss out.

[Chrisjay]

You missed out the last bit know when to walk away, you have a tendency to live in and with the past instead of looking at what can be done to make a difference in the future.  An awful lot of your energy goes into looking back and little positive at taking things forward we cannot undone what has gone before only learn from it and move forward.

You post what you would like to see but you never post how you would get there which makes getting people on board to support you difficult as you never come forward with ideas only wishes.

If you could put forward ideas on how to achieve your goals for a £240 state pension maybe others would come on board to help.

Just a humble suggestion

[Chrisjay]

John

If you read my post I told you I was not in this country in 1980 so I hardly see how 'my' generation who were getting older in another country are responsible for what went on here.

It would be useful if you did not make your posts so personal in attacking members rather than aiming where the blame lies.

I do not think identifying the members of the forum who where a certain age and therefore according to you culpable for all the errors of that generation is useful but suggesting ways we can  remedy those mistakes would be.

In France during the second world war the British dropped bombs (called today 'friendly fire') on Canadians fighting to liberate the French - many of my peers families have hated the British ever since, what use, what a waste of energy.  Others were positive and built memorials to honour the dead and moved on.  We need to move on from the past and deal with the potential future of pensioners in a positive way.

Chris

PS I don't miss out as you put it I was able to claim my state pension when I was 60 it is only women born after 1950 who have to work longer

[Ivanhoe]

John Sheffield, Thatcher did not break the State pensions link to earnings to save money, Thatcher broke the State pension link to earnings because this was part of her agenda to roll back "the roll of the state", Thatcher simply did not believe in the "State" and what the state at that time had provided.

"New" Labour's mistake, ( for want of a better word ) was in continuing Thatcher's agenda in everyway, not just pensions.

I got involved in the pensioners cause as late as 1987, 7 years after the earnings link was broke, prior to 1987 I was not a political animal at all, but from 1987 I joined the Labour party as an activist prior to Blair taking Labour to the right, and I joined because having then learned about Thatcher, I wanted to play an active part in her demise.

However I do understand what you are saying, from your point of view too many people are involved now for seemingly their own sake, yes, or no ?

[Papaumau]

Ivanhoe,

What on earth are you on about? 'sticking pins in?'

I simply asked if you  Papa and Visa protested in your middle age when  the pension-index was broke in 1980. So I'll ask the question again.

Can Ivanhoe  Papa, Visa inform the group how old you were in 1980 and how you protested against this cut.

I for one can honestly say that I have been interested in how the British pensioners are looked after by successive governments. ( In fact it was with my eventual pension in mind that I joined the civil service in 1966 ).

I watch out for rip-offs all of the time, ( as can be seen by my own website - shown in the signature banner below ), and rip-offs of the weakest and the poorest in British society should ALWAYS be interesting to all ages.

When I saw the index-link to the average wage being cut by Thatcher's axe-men I was up in arms as was many more at the time. We all knew that as soon as this link was connected to the inflation-rate that the actual value of the pension would slowly be eroded away.

It HAS BEEN and now we see even the Tories scrabbling to remake the index link with the average wage.

Whether we, ( and yes, I am now a state pensioner ), will get any of this lost income back-dated is quite another story.

[Ivanhoe]

////////It HAS BEEN and now we see even the Tories scrabbling to remake the index link with the average wage.////

Yes but even this increase to the state pension wont come in until 2015, five years from now.

[Chrisjay]

And it will only be for new claimants and there are winners and losers in the Citizens Pension

winners will be women who often fail to qualify for the full basic pension, married couples would also benefit

Losers there is speculation anyone retiring before this is brought in will not be part of the reformed system

Over the next 10 years women's pension age will rise to 66 and men from 65 to 66

Winners are anyone aged 57 or over who will not have to work till they are 66

Losers anyone under the age of 57 before April 6Th this year will now have to wait until some time past their 65Th Birthday

When it comes to forced retirement it is due to be abolished from October 2011

Winners People who have not paid off their mortgages or the value of their pensions has fallen

Losers employers will argue that in some circumstance not being able to retire older staff if they can no longer properly do the job

The new National Employment Saving Trust Scheme is due to come into force from 2012

Winners those who do not have a private pension will have automatic access to a pension plan

Losers those on very low incomes and part time workers probably won't qualify and the scheme could add costs to employers potentially leading to job losses

So it looks like those of us who have already retired will still be means tested and have to rely on add ons if they have no private pension

[Ivanhoe]

Chris, this country is finished, the politicians and the media are running things to suit themselves, because we British are a docile nation politically.

Just look at the French now, protesting because Sarcozy is planning to increase the retiremernt age from 60, to 62, and what do we Brit's do, absolutely nothing.

[Chrisjay]

It might be 'finished' as you put it but unfortunately we still have to live in it

[Ivanhoe]

/////// but unfortunately we still have to live in it //////

And this is about all we do.

[visa]

Ivanhoe,

What on earth are you on about? 'sticking pins in?'

I simply asked if you  Papa and Visa protested in your middle age when  the pension-index was broke in 1980. So I'll ask the question again.

Can Ivanhoe  Papa, Visa inform the group how old you were in 1980 and how you protested against this cut.

Ivanhoe,

What on earth are you on about? 'sticking pins in?'

I simply asked if you  Papa and Visa protested in your middle age when  the pension-index was broke in 1980. So I'll ask the question again.

Can Ivanhoe  Papa, Visa inform the group how old you were in 1980 and how you protested against this cut.

I for one can honestly say that I have been interested in how the British pensioners are looked after by successive governments. ( In fact it was with my eventual pension in mind that I joined the civil service in 1966 ).

I watch out for rip-offs all of the time, ( as can be seen by my own website - shown in the signature banner below ), and rip-offs of the weakest and the poorest in British society should ALWAYS be interesting to all ages.

When I saw the index-link to the average wage being cut by Thatcher's axe-men I was up in arms as was many more at the time. We all knew that as soon as this link was connected to the inflation-rate that the actual value of the pension would slowly be eroded away.

It HAS BEEN and now we see even the Tories scrabbling to remake the index link with the average wage.

Whether we, ( and yes, I am now a state pensioner ), will get any of this lost income back-dated is quite another story.

[visa]

In reply to John Sheffield,s question as to if i was actively involved in the 1980,s or better known as the Thatcher era,you seem to be having a go  for what reason i dont know, but i think the reason will most probably arise in the near future.I come from a hard working back ground and in the 1980,s i fought against Margaret Thatcher and everything she stood for,i,m not the first to say this but "where she is going she will not require central heating"
Reasonable suggestion,s would be more of an advantage instead of trying to identify members. Visa

[Papaumau]

////////It HAS BEEN and now we see even the Tories scrabbling to remake the index link with the average wage.////

Yes but even this increase to the state pension wont come in until 2015, five years from now.

Ivanhoe....

I think you are referring to the time-stamp that was put on this idea by the last New-Labour government. Gordon Brown gave the "five-year" waiting period after he had been pressurised into saying that New-Labour would re-make that index connection.

Now ALL of the parties agree that it would be a good thing if the index link to the average wage for the state pension was re-connected and the present incumbent government are hoping to introduce this change in the statutes very soon.

Chris......

Yes there are now beginning to show many of the bits of fine-print in the £140.00 across-the-board suggestion and as these details emerge we are going to find that there will be more losers than winners attached to this idea.

I will hold my reaction to this policy until I know ALL of the fine print.

[Ivanhoe]

//////Now ALL of the parties agree that it would be a good thing if the index link to the average wage for the state pension was re-connected and the present incumbent government are hoping to introduce this change in the statutes very soon.//////

The coalition proposed policy is a sham from start to finish, and if introduced in 2015, millions more pensioners will be dead, and or still dying of cold.

This policy is too little, too late.

[Papaumau]

Please let me clarify what has been said and done about this subject so far.

THIS link will take you to a Google search that I did on this subject.

In the attached letter to my constituency MP, ( who was part of the government in power at the time ), and his replies, will - or should - clarify the stance now held by a cross-party force in the present encumbent government.

They all agree that this reconnection of the state pension to the average wage should be made ASAP and this does not mean that we are going to have to wait FIVE YEARS, ( as Brown intimated under a lot of political pressure ).

As is said in MP Gordon Banks's reply to my letter: "This action will be part of the work undertaken by government within this year's term."

Please go to the Google link provided and read the correspondence to me from my MP.