Author Topic: ipso fatso  (Read 1938 times)

caminito

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ipso fatso
« on: Mar 14, 2011, 03:45:58 PM »
Almost one in three people believe those with health problems caused by alcohol, obesity and smoking should pay extra for their care.

Those with 'self inflicted' health worries should not rely just on the NHS but should be forced to pay for their lifestyles, they say.

The findings of a survey of 2,000 people comes as the Coalition government prepares a radical shake-up of the NHS which could see more private firms competing for health contracts.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1365975/Shed-pounds-One-think-obese-pay-extra-health-care.html#ixzz1GaanW63f

cheddar-caveman

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #1 on: Mar 14, 2011, 07:32:02 PM »
I have to agree. It is very difficult to keep my cool when I'm called out to a patient with "breathing problems" for example only to find them smoking when I get there >:(

People who self inflict a condition SHOULD pay for it, why should we? Every day at work we see these "FAT" (I don't go with obese because it sounds nicer) people munching their way through chips, pasties, donuts etc etc.

I actually asked one "huge" man riding a poor little scooter which came first, the fat or the scooter and he admitted he had to use the scooter (supplied by the NHS) because his legs/hips couldn't support him any more! >:( >:( >:(
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Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #2 on: Mar 15, 2011, 09:33:46 AM »
Why stop at fat, make everyone with drink related illnesses including injuries cause by falling over or fighting while drunk, any smoking related illness, drug related including dental care (cocaine rots the teeth) and I suppose we could also include anything resulting in poor eyesight such as books (reading)

Better still we know Tobacco, alcohol and processed foods are bad for us so like drugs lets ban them all so then we can think of another way of picking on people who are overweight and make more men and women anorexic.

The human body certainly in later years has expanded,  I until my 40's weighed 8 stone soaking wet, I eat no more now then I did then, I neither drink, smoke or eat processed foods (as I have said before) I exercise twice daily and I am 'plump'.

So would you like me to go on a starvation diet (along with the government) as the constant criticism of people who are not stick pins is really starting to annoy me.  There are more reasons for being fat than over eating and not exercising in most older people it is health, medication and disability.

As for the young, close down all fast food outlets, ban crisps and pizza from supermarkets along with beer and cigarettes, will there be a difference - unlikely.  Children learn eating and exercise habits from a very young age and schools selling off playgrounds and sports fields certainly has not helped and after school clubs now are computers rather than sports and adults are frightened to run youth clubs and sports clubs for fear of being branded a pedophile if they innocently touch a child.

My aunt died in agony from lung cancer and she never smoked but worked in the factories during the war.  My next door neighbour in Wales smoked and they were both in their late 80's and a fitter (stick pin) couple you could wish to meet.

Quiet often the medication you are on including for diabetes gains you weight so maybe we should not be quite so sweeping in our criticism of people who are FAT. 

Thin people often have just as many health problems including osteoporosis as larger people do - should they pay for their treatment as that is self inflicted and quite often by smoking to keep the weight down.

Do anorexics and people suffering for bulimia pay for their treatment, emergency service personnel as they choose to do the job so mental health problems is self inflicted you see where a sweeping statement can lead to a ludicrous conclusion ??? ???
 

caminito

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #3 on: Mar 15, 2011, 10:22:23 AM »
It is obvious that the UK has a problem with health issues .
Smoking has been legistlated against by banning smoking in public places !
Alcohol is an increasing problem with binge drinking , early age drinking , drunks at A&E, fighting in the streets .etc
One brewery has announced a reduction in the strength of it's beer . Government is discussing a minimum price per unit of alcohol!
Lack of excercise ,especially amongst the young ,with computer games ,TV , etc , instead of outdoor games.

The biggest problem seems to be the food that we eat nowadays . To much procesed food rather than fresh food .
Colouring , preservatives , flavourings , all in abundance in a high percentage of food consumed by the general public.
Aspartame , a lethal additive in drinks and food . The EU has a meeting this month to discuss banning this chemical .It is already banned in the far east !

I agree that as we get older , we tend to put on weight .That's normal . Also medication can/does increase weight .
Obesity could cost the NHS in England as much as £6.3bn a year by 2015 if no effective action is taken, the government has said.
Figures from the Department of Health (DoH) state that obesity already cost primary care trusts (PCTs) £4.2bn last year.


More than 170 companies - including the leading supermarket chains - have signed up to the "responsibility deal" to encourage healthier lifestyles.
The full details will be unveiled later, but pledges on calorie counts on menus and clearer labelling on drinks are expected to be made.
The voluntary agreements for England cover four themes - physical activity, food, alcohol and health at work.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-12737200

Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #4 on: Mar 15, 2011, 12:56:37 PM »
Just because you, CC and Hugh are all slim and hansom does not mean everyone on the forum is as happy about themselves.

To be called fat or obese when people cannot do anything about it is not very nice and I know none of you intend to be cruel or insulting but just maybe you are making other people feel bad about themselves, which is not what this forum intends I am sure.

In your argument about fat or obese people maybe we could emphasise you mean people who eat to excess the wrong foods, or smoke or drink to excess and are bone idle but again there is never one cap fits all.

To make people pay for their NHS care is sweeping and maybe we should be looking at people who have never paid into the NHS or NHS tourists and make them pay for their care along with the huge number of pregnancies that are putting a strain on the NHS particularly Polish women who statistically have a baby within the first year of being here closely followed by Indian women. Could this be anything to do with they can't be deported if they have a child who is a UK citizen? Another topic altogether.


 

caminito

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #5 on: Mar 15, 2011, 04:15:17 PM »
I think that firstly , we must make it clear that we are talking about the "Wayne and Waynetta Slob's" of this world .
Those that only stuff their faces with  the two bad fats ,  trans & saturated fats!

Trans fat is created when processed vegetable oils are hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated. Food sources include candy, cakes, pies, cookies, pastries, crackers, biscuits, cereals, deep fried foods, fatty meat from beef and sheep, soups, margarine and some salad dressings.

Saturated fats should make up no more than about 10% of your calorie intake. Even though saturated fats add flavor to food and can be beneficial in small amounts, in large quantities saturated fat has been shown to clog arteries and cause other cardiovascular health problems.

As we get older , sure we all have a tendency to put on weight . With the ladies it's around the bum and with the men it's on the belly
I am no different to others . If I don't cut down occasionally , I will end up with "beer belly" !
Most men end up with thinning hair or baldness as they age ! That's life , like it or lump it , that's how it goes!

What the article is aimed at  ,is the people who don't eat sensibily. That doesn't mean only living on salad but not over indulging on the "pies"!

Also . Tobacco & Booze are heavily taxed . Most of the cost IS tax , so smokers and drinkers are already paying enormous sums to the government which should more than cover any health care caused by their habits .
Whereas , food has a low taxation rate , sometimes nil and the "bad eaters" who end up with illnesses caused by their habit ,are an extra drain on NHS resouces !
  
There are two parts to the food and health problem !
1 . the fats
2.  the additives .
Both are equally bad for health .

The latest supermarket initiative seems only to apply to fats and not to the additives which are in all processed foods .

I have spent hundreds of hours over the last year , researching additives and their impact on health.
I now believe that we are slowly poisoning ourselves by digesting all the colourings ,flavourings and preservatives that are in our food.
For instance ...
The artificial sweetener aspartame has been the subject of several controversies since its initial approval by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) in 1974. The FDA approval of aspartame was highly contested, with critics alleging that the quality of the initial research supporting its safety was inadequate and flawed and that conflicts of interest marred the approval of aspartame.
It's not a natural product , it's a chemical !
The “Pandora’s box of chameleon-like toxins and tumor agents”
Aspartame was never and cannot be proven to be safe. It is not and cannot be a diet aid because the formaldehyde (from the breakdown of the 10% methanol) gets stored in the fat along with some water. The National Soft Drink Association developed a 30-page protest (in the ’80s) that mentioned the fact that aspartame in a beverage was unstable
The phenylalanine breaks down into diketopiperazine (DKP), a known tumor agent, and it is the reason for the FDA mandated “PHENYLKETONURICS: Contains phenylalanine” (PKU) warning label. Diketopiperazine was the major impediment to approval
YET ..it is in a lot of the food & drink that we buy at the supermarket !




 




Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #6 on: Mar 15, 2011, 04:23:29 PM »
WOW  ;D

You didn't mention the hansom or skinny bit  ;D

Glad to have a response though as I was beginning to worry my new system was not working properly.

When I had chemo the only thing I could keep down was spirilina (seaweed) and if we harested it there would be no starving in the world however, governments won't ever do that they make too much money tampering with our food.
 

caminito

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #7 on: Mar 15, 2011, 05:13:15 PM »
I was thin in my youth , then just right in my 30s & 40's , then a bit of a belly in 50's and now in my 60's .I have to watch the diet.
Though my wife says I still have great legs and a nice bum  ;D
Handsome , well she still thinks so . Haven't asked my mistresses as yet  ::)

I was "deadly" serious about what I had researched in the last year !
Every day I find more and more reports on the dangers of modern living and our food and drink intake.
There seems to be a great coverup on the truth from the Pharmaceutical & Food companies.  So much MONEY involved  !

Every year a committee delivers a report to the US President on how the billions of dollars earmarked for fighting cancer are being used. On May 6 that committee handed in its work for 2010, alerting the President to the gaps in research regarding the environmental causes of cancer. This year, for the first time, this high-brow panel of oncologists courageously pointed the finger at chemicals and other environmental factors that are likely to cause cancer.

In their introduction, the signatories of the report that was handed to President Obama note that the incidence of cancer in children has been rising regularly, a fact that can’t be explained by the usual excuses for rising cancer rates in the population over the past thirty years (aging of the population, increasing use of cancer screening). Neither the increasing age of our population, nor the improvement of screening, have any role in rising rates of cancer in children. Indeed, as the panel now acknowledges, the only plausible explanations have to do with changes in our environment and life-style.

The panel criticizes the current "reactionary" approach, which consists in waiting for proof of the toxicity of a contaminant before measures are taken to reduce people's exposure.

The authors underline the need for a new approach based on the precautionary principle. They criticize the ineffectiveness of the agencies set up to do scientific evaluations -- which are excessively influenced by industry and related lobbies. They point out that it is no longer acceptable that a product or chemical be considered “safe” simply because the company producing it affirms that it has conducted internal research establishing safety.

The panel presents to the President a number of arguments that have long been made by activists that have been concerned about a laissez-faire approach to regulating chemicals in terms of their possible effects on health.

Firstly, even when a pollutant is present in our environment at levels beneath the regulatory maximum, it may nonetheless become toxic because of interaction with other pollutants. The committee asks for more research on this often-neglected "cocktail effect".



specific recommendations that the report states most need to be conveyed to the public in the short term:

* Avoid endocrine disruptors, especially for children and pregnant women. (This includes a number of pesticides, but also children toys made with plasticizers such as phtalhates)   Food and drink containers with the symbols 3 , 6 & 7
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrine_disruptor
* Filter your drinking water (particularly in areas where it may contain industrial chemicals or high levels of pesticides)
* Don't keep your food or water in containers containing Bisphenol A or phtalates (hard plastic containers)
* Prefer organic food. Avoid overcooked meat.

One thing that has come to light , is that if you have a tendancy to cancer or actually have cancer  , THEN eating SUGAR is like throwing petrol on a bonfire  :o
 Cancer cells requires an acidic environment to survive or multiply , so if you create an alkaline enviroment in the body ,then it shrinks and can die!
An interesting part of an article on Michael Douglas's ( actor) recent treatment including radiotheraphy and Chemo ,was that his Doctors put him on an Alkaline diet. Even the Medical Establishment are now taking notice of protocols that were first established in 1953 by Dr Budwig in Germany

caminito

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #8 on: Mar 22, 2011, 01:48:27 PM »
Who ate all the pies & fry ups  :o

An obese family of three has cost the Health Service more than £1.2million in slimming treatments and weight-loss surgery.

Zaneta Jones, 46, and husband David have both had gastric bypasses and their 17stone son Stanleigh, 15, is due to have his stomach stapled later this year.

At their heaviest, the trio had a combined weight of 76st 10lb.
The £1,235,000 cost of their treatments so far would be enough to fund around 1,000 lumpectomies for suspected breast cancer, or a year’s supply of medication for 1,235 Alzheimer’s patients.

The Government has called for a new approach to tackling obesity, which costs the NHS around £4.2billion a year, including £49million in gastric operations.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1368567/The-76st-family-thats-cost-NHS-1-2m--say-going-diet-isnt-option.html#ixzz1HKtSvJt0



Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #9 on: Mar 22, 2011, 01:50:15 PM »
OK I will skip the mars bar for lunch and have it for dinner  ;D
 

caminito

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #10 on: Mar 22, 2011, 01:59:46 PM »
Is that a deep fried Mars Bar  ???
Maybe with a portion of chips on the side  ::)

Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #11 on: Mar 22, 2011, 03:40:05 PM »
As I have been moving heavy furniture on my own all day it is a mars bar and nothing but a mars bar as my sugar levels drop when I do hard labour :-)

Why have I been moving it you ask because I am getting the rest out of storage and I have to make some room for the big fridge freezer, wine fridge (can't live without it any longer besides have nowhere to stand the ice maker, I love gadgets) and the dinning room suite.

Fed up of living with boxes everywhere so I have done away with the last bedroom in favour of storage:-(

Want to volunteer to help?  ;D

 

avalonmpk2

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #12 on: Mar 22, 2011, 03:54:33 PM »
Tax obesity severely
Stone walls do not a prison make nor iron bars a cage.
Richard Lovelace
DO NOT FORGET TO LOG OFF - REMOVE COOKIES

Chrisjay

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Re: ipso fatso
« Reply #13 on: Mar 22, 2011, 05:20:05 PM »
But not Mars bars - all men know when they are in trouble they should always take chocolates rather than flowers  ;D