Author Topic: Lost Airliner  (Read 280 times)

Ashy

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Lost Airliner
« on: Mar 13, 2019, 05:14:18 PM »
It's a very sad turn of events and now the 737 MAX type has been grounded almost all over the world. They cost something like 100 million each to buy but it might be a big mistake to let them fly after two of them crashed in broadly similar circumsatnces, until more is known.
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fortyone

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #1 on: Mar 13, 2019, 05:26:26 PM »
There was a suggestion that a new anti stall safety feature may have been anything but. They certainly have the flight recorders from the latest and almost certainly the first so I would expect they'll know soon enough if it was indeed the same scenario and hopefully if it is a fault. Last I saw the yanks hadn't grounded them. I think if I'd made that decision my arse would be constantly twitching.

zoony

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #2 on: Mar 13, 2019, 05:32:51 PM »
The experienced pilot I heard speaking about it explained that the new anti-stall system was a problem because it worked slightly differently and needed training to use properly. He also mentioned that pilots of the several iterations of the plane had an 80 minute course on a CD as their education for and introduction to it.
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Sheila

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #3 on: Mar 13, 2019, 05:34:56 PM »
I hope Brian's pension fund hasn't invested money in Boeing.
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Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #4 on: Mar 13, 2019, 05:45:30 PM »
I do hope Boeing is not held responsible. But pilot training or the lack of it, is the responsibility of the line.
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zoony

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #5 on: Mar 13, 2019, 07:01:14 PM »
Apparently, Ashy, Boeing were less than forthcoming about pilot training and didn't even have a simulator until they were told to build one. 'S all a bit of a mess, I'm afraid..
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fortyone

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #6 on: Mar 13, 2019, 07:52:13 PM »
US has grounded them now. Daft not to really.

Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #7 on: Mar 14, 2019, 04:33:16 PM »
We need to know why two of them crashed. We don't expect this in the 21st century. We need to know that whatever the causes were, they have been corrected.
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Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #8 on: Mar 14, 2019, 06:03:21 PM »
I note that Boeing has now asked for all 371 of these aeroplanes to be grounded for the time being. Without wishing to speculate unreasonably, it appears that a feature of the aeroplane may have been at the back of these crashes. The questions to be answered is why the pilots allowed it to. Pilots can get confused, and when the aeroplane is relatively near the gound they have to do something quick. In many tragic accidents they have done the opposite to what was required and made their situations worse.
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zoony

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #9 on: Mar 14, 2019, 06:30:18 PM »
Which takes us back to familiarisation and training..
The trouble with our politics is that it puts power into the hands of those most likely to abuse it.

Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #10 on: Mar 22, 2019, 07:20:31 AM »
It has now been revealed that a couple of "optional extras" offered by Boeing, were not provided on either the Lion Air or Ethiopian aeroplanes. Hard to believe that the pilots had no indicator for angle of attack or sensor malfunctions that might have directed the pilots concerned to the equipment that was causing the trouble.

Apparently the responsibility lies with the owner of the aeroplanes, although it appears that the extras must now be provided on all the 737 MAX class.
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Diasi

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #11 on: Mar 22, 2019, 07:25:29 AM »
It has now been revealed that a couple of "optional extras" offered by Boeing, were not provided on either the Lion Air or Ethiopian aeroplanes. Hard to believe that the pilots had no indicator for angle of attack or sensor malfunctions that might have directed the pilots concerned to the equipment that was causing the trouble.

Apparently the responsibility lies with the owner of the aeroplanes, although it appears that the extras must now be provided on all the 737 MAX class.

I'm gobsmacked to learn that commercial aircraft are supplied with a list of optional safety extras.
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Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #12 on: Mar 22, 2019, 07:41:01 AM »
Yes indeed! Considering the number of pilots who have become disoriented when flying in cloud, in the dark, over ice etc, sometimes with disastrous consequences.

One of these aeroplanes costs over 100,000,000 for a start, and we can never pay for the loss of life.
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fortyone

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #13 on: Mar 22, 2019, 09:05:29 AM »
and we can never pay for the loss of life.
Ford proved you could do business calculations on the cost of one many years ago in the Pinto fuel tank scandal. I suspect similar considerations were at work here.

Ashy

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Re: Lost Airliner
« Reply #14 on: Mar 22, 2019, 09:51:33 AM »
I agree that business places a monetary value on life, but what I meant was that all the money on earth will not bring back our loved ones once they have been killed. Although aviation is an expensive hobby, the price of sensible safety devices is probably a bit less than the "value" of a single life. I'm guessing admittedly, but if an attack angle meter cost 200,000 it would be money well spent. Actually I thought they were already part of a pilot's central display next to the artificial horizon... obviously not in every case.
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