Author Topic: Gollywogs.  (Read 355 times)

Diasi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7559
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #15 on: Feb 13, 2020, 11:06:44 PM »
There is absolutely no evidence for this according to the OED, it's a well worn myth apparently.

Wogg may have been derived from GOLLIWOGG which was first used in a book by Florence Kate Upton called "The Adventures Of Two Dutch Dolls And A Golliwogg" published in 1895.

It is better not to believe anything you read on the Internet without spending some time looking for corroborative evidence.  :)

Where did Kate Upton get the name Golliwog from?
Make every day count, each day is precious.

Brexit Has Happened.

zoony

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46450
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #16 on: Feb 14, 2020, 12:16:39 AM »
Damn! Wish I'd thought to ask that very salient question..
" There ain't no Devil, it's jus' God when he's drunk.."

Tom Waites

Ashy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22194
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #17 on: Feb 14, 2020, 05:56:04 AM »
Careful, the PC brigade will come around. Hide your gollies! 😁
The PC brigade will probably make mincemeat of us. Nevertheless it's a fascinating traditional  rag doll however it got its name.
Remainers have the rest of 2020 to transition to rejoiners

Ashy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22194
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #18 on: Feb 14, 2020, 06:20:02 AM »
I wonder if it has any connection with "polliwog" which is an alternative name for a tadpole dating from the 15th century. I would assume it is a dialect word in England but more widely used in America.
Remainers have the rest of 2020 to transition to rejoiners

Diasi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7559
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #19 on: Feb 14, 2020, 07:17:33 AM »
I don't suppose this novel is on sale today.  :o ;D
Make every day count, each day is precious.

Brexit Has Happened.

GrannyMac

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14064
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #20 on: Feb 14, 2020, 07:27:29 AM »
Not with that title or cover Diasi.  It was changed to Ten Little Indians, then changed again to And Then There Were None, which was always the title of the book in the USA version.

https://agathachristie.fandom.com/wiki/And_Then_There_Were_None
Comparison is the thief of joy.

Theodore Roosevelt

klondike

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2075
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #21 on: Feb 14, 2020, 09:17:01 AM »
It was on TV under that last title about a couple of years ago.

Diasi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7559
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #22 on: Feb 14, 2020, 09:25:11 AM »
It was on TV under that last title about a couple of years ago.

It's the same as renaming 'Murder on the Orient Express', 'Murder on the Gatwick Express' & thinking that no one will associate it by it's original name. :o ;D
Make every day count, each day is precious.

Brexit Has Happened.

Jacqueline

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 825
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #23 on: Feb 14, 2020, 09:28:07 AM »
I had that very same book, don't know where it came from (i have a lot of books).  We donated to a local Museum.

GrumpyOldFart

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 220
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #24 on: Feb 14, 2020, 09:56:35 AM »
Where did Kate Upton get the name Golliwog from?

The best I can find is: The Golliwogg was based on a Black minstrel doll that Upton had played with as a small child in New York. The then-nameless "Negro minstrel doll" was treated roughly by the Upton children. Upton reminisces: "Seated upon a flowerpot in the garden, his kindly face was a target for rubber balls..., the game being to knock him over backwards. It pains me now to think of those little rag legs flying ignominiously over his head, yet that was a long time ago, and before he had become a personality.... We knew he was ugly!" (Johnson).

Added: The original doll owned by Florence Upton is now in the V&A and predates the occupation of Egypt by British forces.

http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O64368/golliwogg-golly-doll-unknown/


« Last Edit: Feb 14, 2020, 10:09:56 AM by GrumpyOldFart »

Ashy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 22194
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #25 on: Feb 14, 2020, 10:28:45 AM »
It's the same as renaming 'Murder on the Orient Express', 'Murder on the Gatwick Express' & thinking that no one will associate it by it's original name. :o ;D


TBH it would more likely be Murder on the Stopping Train from Norwich to Leicester.
Remainers have the rest of 2020 to transition to rejoiners

klondike

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2075
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #26 on: Feb 14, 2020, 10:49:32 AM »
I'm not certain but I imagine the last Leicester to Norwich train stopping or not was back in the 60s before Beeching sharpened his axe.

Michael Rolls

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16080
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #27 on: Feb 14, 2020, 10:51:05 AM »
So it really was a stopping train!
Mike
The older I get, the better I was!

klondike

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2075
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #28 on: Feb 14, 2020, 11:00:20 AM »
I think they used to be called milk trains and were only marginally faster than a pushbike.


The railway seems to only be north south now with no east west routes. Just like all roads lead to Rome all railway lines lead to London. I spent many years working a long way from home but after a year commuting by train into London I decided the higher rates earned there were not worth the extra hassle caused by the dreadful train service and just took contracts I could drive to. That was back in 1995/6 and from what I see on TV it has gone downhill since then.

Traveller

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1969
Re: Gollywogs.
« Reply #29 on: Feb 14, 2020, 11:06:51 AM »
A retired army colonel who drank in the same pub as me had some fantastic stories to tell.
Some might even have been true....

One story tells of a collision between a British army lorry and a car carrying the King of Egypt (during the closing days of the British presence there).  At the subsequent inquiry, the lorry driver was asked if he was aware of who was in the car.  Not having been recruited for his diplomacy, he answered, "There were two W*gs in it". 

Horror, shock!   The driver was taken off and given a stern lecture on his language, and the inquiry resumed.  Again he was asked if he knew who was in the car. "Yes sir, it was His serene highness King ......,  and another W*g".
You climbed on the ladder with the wind in your sails,
You came like a comet blazing your trail